tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7442773712288154969.post7246181391332234108..comments2023-11-30T00:26:51.309-08:00Comments on Superstition Free: It's in The Bible: Jesus will give you Hemorrhoids!Robert Madewellhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/13237253238274655114noreply@blogger.comBlogger33125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7442773712288154969.post-89892048639047636502010-02-21T01:04:41.227-08:002010-02-21T01:04:41.227-08:00A said, "You do good works simply because tha...A said, <i>"You do good works simply because that is your purpose for being on earth. You could go to Heaven, even if you didn't do them, but someone who loves God wants to please Him"</i><br /><br />That's how I used to explain it, too. I think there was a saying, 'Justified by faith. Sanctified by works.'<br /><br />Anymore, I just don't buy the 'God exists' thing. That makes such apollogetics pretty much meaningless, to me.Robert Madewellhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13237253238274655114noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7442773712288154969.post-55536236892258028272010-02-20T15:40:43.711-08:002010-02-20T15:40:43.711-08:00GCT, I'm not sure where you get that anyone he...GCT, I'm not sure where you get that anyone here said you had to do good works to be saved. You do good works simply because that is your purpose for being on earth. You could go to Heaven, even if you didn't do them, but someone who loves God wants to please Him, whether there is the threat of Hell behind it or not.anoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7442773712288154969.post-43871514439985153992010-02-20T12:30:21.493-08:002010-02-20T12:30:21.493-08:00So, one is saved by faith alone, meaning one only ...So, one is saved by faith alone, meaning one only must believe the right thing. Yet, apparently, according to Mark and a, that is not true, since one must also do good works and be a good person. This, somehow does not contradict what they said earlier about faith along bringing salvation. Um...right...GCThttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09744295225958022872noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7442773712288154969.post-69956820416898123762010-02-18T23:46:08.778-08:002010-02-18T23:46:08.778-08:00a said...
Oh, and ethinethin said, "I don...a said... <br />Oh, and ethinethin said, "I don't understand "We can act how we want because we're saved by grace."<br /><br />That's not true either. And that is not why the Levitical law doesn't count. The Levitical law doesn't count because God said we had a new covenant with Him once Jesus atoned for our sins. <br /><br /><b> ethinethin, A had already answered your question about Levitical law. I included the verse below. <br /><br />Galatians 3:24 (King James Version)<br /><br /> 24Wherefore the law was our schoolmaster to bring us unto Christ, that we might be justified by faith.</b>Mark Morrisonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00503923536520246772noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7442773712288154969.post-48937795786806972862010-02-18T21:45:34.195-08:002010-02-18T21:45:34.195-08:00"That's what the Bible speaks of as a ...<i>"That's what the Bible speaks of as a 'reprobate mind.'"</i><br /><br />I like that! Look at the header for my blog. I'm going to use it with pride!Robert Madewellhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13237253238274655114noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7442773712288154969.post-69817364826087406522010-02-18T21:42:28.853-08:002010-02-18T21:42:28.853-08:00"No, Robert, you still misunderstand. You say...<i>"No, Robert, you still misunderstand. You say, "Scripture just means writtings" which is not true. See 2 Timothy 3:16."</i><br /><br />Ok, you have a different definition. Good for you.<br /><br /><i>"I'm sorry you feel I'm trying to convert you here, because honestly, I just had the time and wanted to stand up for the gospel."</i><br /><br />Actually, it's ok if you are trying to convert me. I expect it.<br /><br />Yeah, I used to "stand up" for the gospel, too. It's hard to do when it doesn't stand on its own.<br /><br /><i>"You have to judge by the context to understand what is meant."</i><br /><br />I have found long ago that context is one of those things that you don't have when you disagree with someone on interpretation. It seems to be very subjective.<br /><br /><i>"If I can provide a reasonable answer to your question, would you really be converted?"</i> <br /><br />I haven't heard a reasonable answer yet. It's just the same irrational, uncritical thinking that I have heard my entire life. I was forced to believe stuff that made no sense to me. If I was to express disagreement, I was shamed for not being doctrinally sound. That's why I looked into other faiths as a young adult. I found none of them to be true faiths.<br /><br /><i>"Or would you just dig for another question?"</i><br /><br />Probably. Especially, if the answer wasn't reasonable.<br /><br /><i>"I could provide the most logical answers in the world Robert, and you would not believe."</i><br /><br />OK, where's your logical answers?Robert Madewellhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13237253238274655114noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7442773712288154969.post-40357768476010884302010-02-18T19:56:44.576-08:002010-02-18T19:56:44.576-08:00He was talking to the Jews ethinethin, and they DO...He was talking to the Jews ethinethin, and they DO still do those things.anoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7442773712288154969.post-74390220424058419052010-02-18T19:42:33.951-08:002010-02-18T19:42:33.951-08:00Yes, smooth as butter apologetics.
Paul tells you...Yes, smooth as butter apologetics.<br /><br /><i>Paul tells you in Galations Christ hath redeemed us from the <b>curse of the law</b>, being made a <b>curse</b> for us<br /><br />But we know that the <b>law is good</b>, if a man use it lawfully; </i><br /><br />Alright.<br /><br /><i>There is Levitical Law and there is "deca-law" which would be the ten commandments given by God.</i><br /><br />And the same terms are used for both, so how do you know when to use one and when to use the other? Why did they not explicitly say which one they were referring to?<br /><br /><i>If you interuse these things, you would be very confused about what is being said. You have to judge by the context to understand what is meant.</i><br /><br />Judging by context is not enough, because obviously there is some confusion there. I would think that if your holy book really was infallible, there wouldn't be these grey areas.<br /><br />So how can you tell Jesus was talking about "deca law" and Paul was talking about "Levitical law"? What are the contextual clues you are using? Are you using contextual clues like you claim, or are you using your own presuppositions about what they meant?<br /><br /><i>ethinethin that wasn't a contridiction. Jesus did fulfil the law. In doing so He released us from the curse of the law. </i><br /><br />Sorry Mark, I don't buy it. I know you believe it so it makes sense to you, but it just sounds like ridiculous nonsense to me. Did God say in Leviticus "these laws will stand until someone comes and fulfills them"? Or did he say<br /><br /><b>It shall be a statute for ever throughout your generations</b> (<i>Leviticus 23:14,21,31</i>)<br /><br />Am I quoting out of context? Did he say immediately after that "Oh, except when I send someone to fulfill it."? Or is it some alternate definition of "for ever" that I am not aware of?fuuuuckhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00405240043522723435noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7442773712288154969.post-63909762645174561352010-02-18T19:19:51.289-08:002010-02-18T19:19:51.289-08:00ethinethin that wasn't a contridiction. Jesus ...ethinethin that wasn't a contridiction. Jesus did fulfil the law. In doing so He released us from the curse of the law. <br /><br />Paul tells you in Galations Christ hath redeemed us from the curse of the law, being made a curse for us: for it is written, Cursed is every one that hangeth on a tree: <br /><br />So then what is the law for ? Look at this 1 Timothy,8But we know that the law is good, if a man use it lawfully; <br /><br /> 9Knowing this, that the law is not made for a righteous man, but for the lawless and disobedient, for the ungodly and for sinners, for unholy and profane, for murderers of fathers and murderers of mothers, for manslayers, <br /><br /> 10For whoremongers, for them that defile themselves with mankind, for menstealers, for liars, for perjured persons, and if there be any other thing that is contrary to sound doctrine;<br /><br />Now this verse makes since. <br />Christ is the end of the law for righteousness to every one that believeth. You have to believe in Jesus to be free from the law. <br /><br />No contridictions here.Mark Morrisonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00503923536520246772noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7442773712288154969.post-60871725390480248212010-02-18T17:18:46.661-08:002010-02-18T17:18:46.661-08:00Oh, and ethinethin said, "I don't underst...Oh, and ethinethin said, "I don't understand "We can act how we want because we're saved by grace."<br /><br />That's not true either. And that is not why the Levitical law doesn't count. The Levitical law doesn't count because God said we had a new covenant with Him once Jesus atoned for our sins. Being saved by grace is never an excuse to sin. Ephesians 2:10 says we are "created in Christ Jesus unto good works." While our good works are not what save us, we are still created for the soul purpose of doing them. I hope this clarifies it a bit.anoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7442773712288154969.post-9231792949593691592010-02-18T17:15:50.017-08:002010-02-18T17:15:50.017-08:00No, Robert, you still misunderstand. You say, &qu...No, Robert, you still misunderstand. You say, "Scripture just means writtings" which is not true. See 2 Timothy 3:16.<br /><br />Also, I now understand your confusion about what Jesus said and what Paul said, and really all quotes about the law. There is Levitical Law and there is "deca-law" which would be the ten commandments given by God. If you interuse these things, you would be very confused about what is being said. You have to judge by the context to understand what is meant. <br /><br />I'm sorry you feel I'm trying to convert you here, because honestly, I just had the time and wanted to stand up for the gospel. Usually I won't even begin speaking about any apologetics and such, until I ask the question, "If I can provide a reasonable answer to your question, would you really be converted? Or would you just dig for another question?" I could provide the most logical answers in the world Robert, and you would not believe. I think you have so dismissed God that more than likely he has hardened your heart as fulfillment of your own desire. That's what the Bible speaks of as a "reprobate mind." You want to disbelieve beyond all reason? God'll let you do that.anoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7442773712288154969.post-44192028840314220742010-02-18T14:27:49.156-08:002010-02-18T14:27:49.156-08:00Regardless of what Paul teaches, though, why is it...Regardless of what Paul teaches, though, why is it okay to "throw away Levitical Law" if Jesus said it still applies?<br /><br />I don't understand "We can act how we want because we're saved by grace". I do understand "these archaic laws were written by ancient pastoralists and don't apply to modern man", though. <br /><br />You're free to think eating pork or shellfish is an unrighteous act if you want. Doesn't stop you from doing it, so who cares?fuuuuckhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00405240043522723435noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7442773712288154969.post-39590403096660671452010-02-18T14:23:45.144-08:002010-02-18T14:23:45.144-08:00Well in this particular example, the "Matthew...Well in this particular example, the "Matthew" Robert threw down a few posts ago seems to be directly contradicted by Paul in Romans.<br /><br /><b>Jesus:</b> Think not that I am come to destroy the law, or the prophets: I am not come to destroy, but to fulfil. <i>(Matthew 5:17)</i><br /><br /><b>Paul:</b> Christ is the end of the law for righteousness to every one that believeth. <i>(Romans 10:4)</i><br /><br />It seems to me that Jesus was saying "how you act is important, follow the law, it still applies". Paul disagreed and said "act however you want, as long as you believe in christ, don't worry about the law".<br /><br />I'm sure it's a little more nuanced than that, if you slather it with apologetic butter, but but this certainly seems like a direct contradiction to me.<br /><br />Paul of Tarsus was the Joseph Smith / L. Ron Hubbard / Jim Jones of his era.fuuuuckhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00405240043522723435noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7442773712288154969.post-3856068131637239072010-02-18T11:55:21.178-08:002010-02-18T11:55:21.178-08:00ethinethin said...
(or should I say "Who is r...ethinethin said...<br />(or should I say "Who is right on this, Jesus or Paul?", since Paul had no problem directly contradicting the words of Jesus on a regular basis<br /><br />Please show me where he has done this.Mark Morrisonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00503923536520246772noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7442773712288154969.post-46955062442310246202010-02-18T08:40:11.634-08:002010-02-18T08:40:11.634-08:00(or should I say "Who is right on this, Jesus...(or should I say "Who is right on this, Jesus or Paul?", since Paul had no problem directly contradicting the words of Jesus on a regular basis)fuuuuckhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00405240043522723435noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7442773712288154969.post-79307860487988123172010-02-18T07:25:47.458-08:002010-02-18T07:25:47.458-08:00What am I missing? That looks like Jesus is saying...What am I missing? That looks like Jesus is saying the old laws still apply, which is not what "a" said. Who is right on this, Jesus (God) or "a" (anonymous)?fuuuuckhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00405240043522723435noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7442773712288154969.post-91261946143786092182010-02-17T18:08:53.205-08:002010-02-17T18:08:53.205-08:00Here's the bible reference, Ethinethin.
For ...Here's the bible reference, Ethinethin. <br /><br /><i>For verily I say unto you, Till heaven and earth pass, one jot or one tittle shall in no wise pass from the law, till all be fulfilled. Whosoever therefore shall break one of these least commandments, and shall teach men so, he shall be called the least in the kingdom of heaven: but whosoever shall do and teach them, the same shall be called great in the kingdom of heaven.</i> <a href="http://skepticsannotatedbible.com/mt/5.html#18" rel="nofollow">Matthew 5:18-19</a><br /><br />My old KJV has all this in red. I wonder why. Oh yeah! Because Jesus said that!Robert Madewellhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13237253238274655114noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7442773712288154969.post-17521527994398340292010-02-17T16:14:00.582-08:002010-02-17T16:14:00.582-08:00You can toss them all out.
Oh, can we? Every jot ...<i>You can toss them all out.</i><br /><br />Oh, can we? Every jot and tittle?fuuuuckhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00405240043522723435noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7442773712288154969.post-52981947211041253392010-02-16T23:16:42.981-08:002010-02-16T23:16:42.981-08:00Kudos, A.
At least you are sticking to your guns ...Kudos, A.<br /><br />At least you are sticking to your guns with respect to Dahmer. I've had many "saved by grace" christians argue with me that there's a possibilty that Dahmer is in heaven. They say "saved by grace", but they don't really believe it.<br /><br />You know, I don't care what someone believes. If a christian does not believe in "saved by grace", I could care less. However, I'm not impressed if they say they do but don't act like it. I just think that what they say should mirror what they act like.<br /><br />That's why I'm giving you a hard time about saying that you believe the entire bible. See, just because you have apollogetics that explain why the OT is obsolete, doesn't negate the fact that you don't believe the entire bible. All you have proven is that you can explain why you don't believe the entire bible. I don't care if you do or don't. I'm just put off by your claiming you do, while you really don't. Again, this is the wrong path to go down, if you wish for me to convert.<br /><br />Here's an old money quote.<br /><br /><b>All Christians are <a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cafeteria_Christianity" rel="nofollow">Cafeteria Christians</a>. Even, the fundamentalists. They just don't admit it. -- Me</b><br /><br /><i>"I'm not saying that the Old Testament isn't scripture."</i><br /><br />Neither am I. Scripture just means writtings. That's all. I would apply the term mainly to ancient religious texts. The term does not mean it's inspired.Robert Madewellhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13237253238274655114noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7442773712288154969.post-55796930234336676812010-02-16T22:56:48.041-08:002010-02-16T22:56:48.041-08:00I really don't care how you justify it, A. I&#...I really don't care how you justify it, A. I'm sure the Jehovah's Witness has an explaination to justify his disbelief in an eternal hell.<br /><br />I really see little difference between the different sects of fundamentalism other than subtly different interpretations of the bible. I am just not impressed at all with christianity's silly little in-fighting. It's one of the many things that lead me from christianity. So, your running down the wrong path if you wish to convert me by arguing who's a True Christian™ or not.<br /><br />Again, why should I believe you and not him? Why should I believe him and not you? Do you think these are unreasonable questions?Robert Madewellhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13237253238274655114noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7442773712288154969.post-88299987025380322212010-02-16T19:57:05.128-08:002010-02-16T19:57:05.128-08:00Jeffrey Dahmer could certainly go to Heaven. And ...Jeffrey Dahmer could certainly go to Heaven. And I'm not saying that the Old Testament isn't scripture. I'm saying that God told us that the laws of it were no longer in action once Jesus came and died on the cross. There is a difference between that and just throwing away something God didn't tell you was ok to throw away.anoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7442773712288154969.post-38978271417732967732010-02-16T19:41:20.184-08:002010-02-16T19:41:20.184-08:00A also said, "GCT, God does expect us to act ...A also said, <i>"GCT, God does expect us to act morally, considering that He invented morals. However, that is not what guages our eternal destination. Considering that only God is immutable, he is the only thing we can know as a true guidepost of morals."</i><br /><br />If morals is not what God guages our eternal destination by, that means that <a href="http://superstitionfree.blogspot.com/2008/12/jeffrey-dahmer-is-in-heaven.html" rel="nofollow">Jeffrey Dahmer is in heaven</a>. You'll be surpised how many chritians argue that he is not in heaven.Robert Madewellhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13237253238274655114noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7442773712288154969.post-79586753533691755152010-02-15T23:06:17.723-08:002010-02-15T23:06:17.723-08:00A said, "I would also argue Robert that a Jeh...A said, <i>"I would also argue Robert that a Jehovah's Witness is not a Christian, considering they don't even believe in eternal Heaven OR Hell. Of course, you'll brush that off as the "not a true Christian" argument, nevermind the fact that it is a valid argument as long as being a Christian hinges on believing the entire Bible or not."</i><br /><br /><b>I would argue that you don't believe the entire bible, either. As a matter of fact you admitted it in the same post that you criticized JWs for not believing the entire bible.</b><br /><br />A said, <i>"You can toss them all out. Unless you find it in the New Testament, you don't have to live by it anymore. That's why it is the NEW Testament."</i><br /><br /><b>Last I checked, the old testament is included in the entire bible.<br /><br />Don't worry, though. I have no problem, if you don't believe the entire bible. I just don't think it's fair to criticize Jehovah's Witnesses for not following the entire bible, when you don't follow the entire bible, either.<br /><br />Besides, you missed my point. Maybe, I didn't make it very clear.<br /><br />Why should I believe what you say as opposed to what someone else says? What make your beliefs more believable to me than the beliefs of the Jehovah's Witnesses, Seventh Day Adventists, Community of Christ, Christian Science, etc.?<br /><br />Why should I listen to you? What makes an anonymous commentor special? I'm not intending to be condescending. I really want to know. This is your chance to prosyletize.</b>Robert Madewellhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13237253238274655114noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7442773712288154969.post-50087794237632880012010-02-15T22:39:13.953-08:002010-02-15T22:39:13.953-08:00You can toss them all out. Unless you find it in ...You can toss them all out. Unless you find it in the New Testament, you don't have to live by it anymore. That's why it is the NEW Testament.<br /><br />GCT, God does expect us to act morally, considering that He invented morals. However, that is not what guages our eternal destination. Considering that only God is immutable, he is the only thing we can know as a true guidepost of morals. <br /><br />I would also argue Robert that a Jehovah's Witness is not a Christian, considering they don't even believe in eternal Heaven OR Hell. Of course, you'll brush that off as the "not a true Christian" argument, nevermind the fact that it is a valid argument as long as being a Christian hinges on believing the entire Bible or not.anoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7442773712288154969.post-61185440664775098802010-02-15T16:42:43.652-08:002010-02-15T16:42:43.652-08:00You should also realize that your post about "...<i>You should also realize that your post about "markings" as Tim Tebow did references a Levitical law which no longer is in effect to anyone.</i><br /><br />That's the thing about "Levitical law". Christians seem to pick the ones they like and toss out the ones they don't. How do you decide which ones to follow and which ones to toss out?fuuuuckhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00405240043522723435noreply@blogger.com